Rif Shabbat 2b

HIDE/SHOW IMAGE
2b

{Shabbat 7a continued}
he cited Rabbi Yochanan:
This is necessary only in respect of a corner near a street {Soncino: at which stood a house the front of which the owner had thrown open to the public} though the masses sometimes press and overflow therein, yet since it is inconvenient for [general] use, it ranks as a karmelith.

When Rav Dimi came, he cited Rabbi Yochanan: [The place] between the pillars {erected in the market upon which traders hung their wares} is treated as a karmelith.

Rav Yehuda cited Rabbi Zera {our girsa: Rabbi Zera cited Rav Yehuda}: The balcony in front of the pillars is treated as a karmelith.

Now, he who stated thus of [the ground] between the pillars, — how much more so the balcony! But he who mentions the balcony-but between the pillars, no, for there are times that the public trods there.

And the halacha is like Rabbi Yochanan {that between the pillars as well as the balcony is considered a karmelith}.

Rava bar Shela cited Rav Chisda: If a brick is standing upright in the street, and one throws [an article] {at least four cubits in the street} and it adheres to its side, he is liable; on top, he is not liable {since it forms a separate domain}.

Abaye and Rava both state: {on top he is not liable} Providing that it is three handbreadths high, and {our girsa: so that ד/ו} the public do not step on it, but thorns and shrubs, even though they are not three handbreadths high {, no - that is, he would be liable, since it is part of the street}.
Rav Chiyya bar Ashi said: Even thorns and shrubs, but dung, no.
Rav Ashi said: Even dung.

When Rav Dimi came, he said {our gemara: in the name of Rabbi Yochanan}: There is no karmelith less than four by four {handbreadths}.

Rav Shesheth said: And it extends up to ten {handbreadths}.

That until ten, it is a karmelith. Higher than ten, it is a mekom petur {a place of non-liability}.

{Shabbat 7b}
And the Sages treated it with the leniencies of the private domain and the leniencies of the public domain.
With the leniencies of the private domain - that if there is a place 4 X 4 {handbreadths} it is a karmelith, and if not, it is not a karmelith.
With the leniencies of the public domain - that until ten {handbreadths} it is a karmelith, and higher than ten, it is not a karmelith but rather a mekom petur.

Rav Gidel cited Rav Chiyya bar Yosef, who cited Rav: A house which does not have inside of it ten handbreadths, but its ceiling completes it to a height of ten - upon its roof it is permitted to carry throughout, but inside, one may only carry within four cubits {that is, it has the status of karmelith}.
Abaye said: And if he carved out {in the floor} an area 4 X 4 {handbreadths}, thus completing its height of ten, it is permitted to carry inside throughout.
What is the reason?
It has the status of the cavities of the private domain, and the cavities of the private domain is like the private domain.
For it was stated {by Amoraim}: and the cavities of the private domain is like the private domain; the cavities of the public domain - Abaye said: is like the public domain, and Rava said: it is not like the public domain.

And the halacha is like Rava, and since it {the cavities of the public domain} is not like the public domain, if it has 4 X 4 handbreadths and its height is ten {handbreadths}, it is like the private domain; and if it has 4 X 4 handbreadths but its height is not ten, it is like a karmelith; and if it does not have 4 X 4 handbreadths, even if its height is ten, it is a mekom petur.

Rav Chisda said: If one fixes a rod in private ground and throws [an article from the street] and it alights on the top, even if it is a hundred cubits high, he is liable, because private ground extends up to heaven.

And specifically {if he fixes it} in the private domain, but in the public domain, it is a mekom petur.

{Shabbat 8a}
Abaye said: If one throws a {round, large} bin into the public domain, which {the bin} is ten {handbreadths} high and 6 X 6 {handbreadths} wide, he is not liable; if it is not 6 X 6 wide, he is liable.